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EP 38: Brian Brinkley, CEO at QRails

Podcast Transcript

James Mackey  0:00  

Hello, and welcome to Talent Acquisition Trends & Strategy. Today we're joined by Brian Brinkley. Brian, welcome to the show!


Brian Brinkley  0:18  

Hey, glad to be here.


James Mackey  0:19  

Well, thank you. Prior to the show, you give me a little bit of background on what the company is doing, so I could actually ask good questions today. 


So I'm excited to learn more about your company and how y'all are disrupting the space that you're in. But before we jumped into all the fun topics or discussion today, I was hoping you could just provide everybody with a bit of insight into what you do, what you're up to, up to your background. I want to make sure our audience knows the perspective you're coming from for today's conversation.


Brian Brinkley  0:47  

Sure. So I'm currently the CEO of a company called  QRails, we actually have a product called AnyDay, we focus on building what I'll call a financial wellness platform, and that financial wellness platform is key, to offering his earned wage access. And earned wage access, as the name states are the ability to give people access to wages that they've already earned. Unlike predatory lending, we don't lend people any money, what we do is integrate into HR Payroll, or Time and Attendance systems. 


And let's say you were doing something in the gig economy, or piecemeal work or working as a waiter, and you wanted access digitally, you know, to like tips or mileage, or some sort of work that you've done, you can just click a button, and we can either ACH it to your existing bank account, or we can actually issue you a payroll card. And within 20 milliseconds, you could have it on a debit card, and you could use it while you're standing in line trying to make a purchase.


James Mackey  1:49  

Yeah, that's really cool. So like one way to just super simplify, would be, hypothetically, if you're working for Uber, right, you could get access to your wages, the same day, once the service is completed. So you work in the morning from 9 am to 1 pm. Later that day, you'd be able to collect those wages, the same day. Is that a very simplified kind of concept? Does that make sense? Or?


Brian Brinkley  2:14  

Yeah, that's perfect. Matter of fact, I think Uber is the one that is credited for kicking off this earned wage access platform, you know, they started off by issuing their drivers in some countries, just a payroll card. So you know, like they're driving all day, they're burning up their gas, right? Not the company's gas. And on the way home, you know, that you'd have to stop and fill up and get more gas and stuff to reset for the next day. So it was an incentive to get them to come back to work. The next day is opposed to waiting a week or two weeks or a month for pay. They get paid at the end of the day. And then I think that's just ballooned up into the gig economy in itself.


James Mackey  2:52  

For sure. Do you know how they rolled that out initially I'm assuming at that point in time like there weren't cool services like what your team is doing? I wonder how they actually were able to pull that off from an operational perspective.


Brian Brinkley  3:05  

Yeah, funny. It's interesting. I think the guy that was doing it was a guy named Peter Hazlehurst and he and I had worked at Google together. And he just went over there from a company called Postmates. And he said, What should we do to set us apart from everybody else? And I was like, Well, why don't you guys issue cards, you know so that you could actually do this for people to get retention in employees? No, because they're all contracted employers. And they did that. But they actually expanded it to what we would call financial wellness by saying, Well, we can do credit, scoring and lending people money for cars, I am leasing cars and doing insurance.


So that's really how we got started, as I took that concept that Uber built and said, Why don't we do this for everybody else, you know, everybody else in the industry, we could never pick who's gonna be the next Uber or Lyft or Alibaba or WeChat. What we could do is build a financial services platform and embed it into other HR Payroll systems and Time and Attendance systems, so that the average small-medium-sized business could do the same thing as Uber and provide the same kind of benefits to their workers that Uber did.


James Mackey  4:15  

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I have a lot of questions. I guess my first one is just high-level. Why is the focus on the gig economy? Why not for services firms, SaaS companies, and enterprises? What is the reasoning for honing in on the GIG services industry?


Brian Brinkley  4:36  

Well, I think when I started, that's where we headed into, but like I was telling you earlier, we had gone down that path to the gig economy, because we were trying to integrate into these Time and Attendance systems, but then SAP came to us and said, Hey, can you integrate this into saps platform because they were trying to do the same thing also. And we did and we also integrated into I think Sony prism HR, which provides software to a bunch of PEOs. And we get it for a company called Alight, which actually handles the majority of the top 100, Fortune 100 companies. And we found that a lot of people are doing it for a lot of different reasons other than the gig economy. And if you don't mind, I'll give you a little anecdotal information. 


You know, when I was younger, I would tell people, there was a point in time where my parents, they would say, they would go somewhere to buy a car or buy a part house or something in that people go, when do you want your bill to be handed to you because they were getting paid on the, you know, the 15th and the 31st of every month, and they can line their bill pay up with their income. But now you don't have that opportunity, right? I mean, let's say you work and you get paid every two weeks on a Friday, but your rent is due on Wednesday, it doesn't mean that you're poor, it just means that you don't have access to rent today, or your car payment today, because you're out of step or your cycle payrolls out of step. 


So we find that this really helps people that either have an internal emergency that they don't have access to cash to, or they're just out of step with an existing payroll cycle. So they can move money that they've already earned from their employer, directly to their payer, or to their bank account, or actually, make a pay in line. Does that make sense? Yeah, because more people are doing it now than just gig economy workers.


James Mackey  6:33  

Well, you know, what's really cool about this, and I feel like this is a trend in financial services, specifically to consumers or that consumers kind of like the end beneficiary of it, is that we're seeing a lot more management and flexibility when it comes to cash flow management.


Brian Brinkley  6:49  

That's exactly what I would say it's more cash flow for the employee management. That's what it is.


James Mackey  6:54  

Right. Like I know, it's like a b2b solution that you're providing. But like, when I'm talking like on an individual level, the benefit is to maybe, I don't know what you consider like consumer, right? It's like, it's interesting, these tools, it sounds like this industry is expanding. And then you also have companies like a firm, or what's the other one? There's no like these late payment companies, where when you check out, it's like, you can pay over four months, right?


So it's interesting, it's like this is how, like a CFO would manage the business, right? Like, let's get the money in as soon as possible. Let's extend the payments as long as possible, right? So it's giving people a lot more, you know, financial wellness, flexibility, freedom, whatever you want to call it, I definitely see the value in these types of solutions.


Brian Brinkley  7:35  

It's funny because we, and I'll read this to you, actually built our mission statement. And our mission statement says empowering employees and working families with innovative financial wellness. And I tell people, it sounds weird to have a vision statement. But we had hone that down to say we're just what you pointed out, we're talking about employees, you know, and their financial wellness and how do we build a set of tools around them so that they can have education on financial wellness, credit, scoring, you know, lending if they need it. But it's not about being predatory lending, it's about giving them access to the money that they've already made when they need it, not when somebody wants to give it to them, right? That's exactly what it is. And then being able to take those kinds of things and roll them out. I'll give you another piece of anecdotal information. 


So let's say you're working in a restaurant, and you're picking up shifts, and then we look and we say that you're out of sync, but we're integrated. We're integrated into the time and attendance system and your bill pay system. And we go, Oh my gosh, you know what, if you pick up two more shifts between now and next Friday, then you can pay your rent without being overdue, collecting a late fee, or something like that. So we can say, hey, scheduled another eight hours here or another 16 hours to shift? And then that'll prevent you from getting into this long-term debt cycle, right? So we can look at Time and Attendance systems at restaurants, or in companies. I mean, we're working with a trucking company now that we're doing that with, it's kind of cool.


James Mackey  9:14  

That is really cool. So one of my questions, just in terms of operationally how this works. Is some of this about floating cash, like, is there that type of element of banking? Because I mean, obviously, right, in businesses that collect from the customer later than when they pay people, how does that work?


Brian Brinkley  9:36  

Well, big, big, big companies have enough money to do payroll right? So we can move money from them directly to the employer if we want to. Some companies fault their debt through a revolving credit line. You know, you always hear about Black Friday, most of the time they're in debt, we can move it from there, or we can float it. How we do it is we inject a payroll deduct one line item into the payroll platform. So we know we're getting paid back because we know that person's gotten paid. And then what happens is we move that money to the employee themselves. And this is the cool part about it. 


When I built this company, we decided we weren't going to charge the employee for a year or two, and we were going to provide a free option for the employee. So how we make our money back, is when we put it on a payroll card, because we're a card issuer processor, we make money off the interchange that MasterCard gives us for processing, MasterCard, or discovered us. So we like to tell everybody, we're not adding any more weight into the system, we're not putting any more expense in the system, we're just actually moving money onto cards and through the existing system, so we can offer it free. And we know we're gonna get paid back because it's a payroll deduction. 


James Mackey  10:54  

So it's free to the client. Oh, that's really cool. Yeah, that sounds like really cool stuff.


Brian Brinkley  11:01  

Right? Like, we always say, how is it that you can give people money when they need it? When do they want it? It's free to the employer, it's free to the employee. What else is there? I don't really know. Right?


James Mackey  11:12  

I hear you. So one of the things you talked about was integrations with time and attendance. You also mentioned PEOs, do you partner directly with PEOs? So that PEOs can then offer this to their customers? Or what does that integration look like within the PEO community?


Brian Brinkley  11:31  

Yeah, so I think we integrated with a company called PrismHR. And they're the software provider, much like SAP and Oracle and Workday are is they provide HR Payroll Software. And so we integrated with the software company, they provide it to the PEOs. So now any PEO and an employer that uses PrismHR software, for example, can just turn our system on, they can call their PEO and say we want to activate that. And then we can turn that system on for them. And they can start providing this to their employees immediately. 


We also are fully integrated, you can anybody can Google this go out to SAP, and we're the first and only certified earn wage access provider on SAP software. And we're also integrated into Workday software through alight and a couple of other integrators that I can't mention their name yet because it's not been publicly released. But we're covering everybody except for Oracle right now.


James Mackey  12:35  

So that's really cool. I see you're knocking down some really big partnerships, which is incredible.


Brian Brinkley  12:41  

We're trying. I mean, hopefully, we'll get to a point where everybody looks at us and sees us as a big software provider and will be an overnight success after four years of hard work. 


James Mackey  12:51  

That's how it goes. Right? You work hard for 10 years, and then overnight success. So I saw it online, but I wasn't 100% certain. It looks like you possibly venture capital back to series A is that right?


Brian Brinkley  13:08  

That's correct. Were series A venture capital back? That's correct.


James Mackey  13:11  

Okay. What are the next steps in terms of partnership scale? What do you see the business doing over the next couple of years? 


Brian Brinkley  13:24  

That's a great question. I mean, what we're going to do, somebody's chiming in, what we're going to do is we're starting to raise a B round now. So after we did all the integration that we were talking about, and all the deployments and we're starting to get out on these pilot projects, and what I'll call these first round projects that we have, then we're looking for his growth capital to expand in this space. I mean, if you just took the total addressable market for SAP and workday, and prism, it's huge. So we're gonna go find some growth capital to expand our penetration into this total addressable market. We have.


James Mackey  13:59  

Yeah, for sure. I mean, it just sounds like probably scaling quite rapidly, particularly when there's really no it doesn't sound like there's any kind of cost burden to the client. It's really just more of like the implementation, right? Like they just have to budget the time to get it implemented within their systems, right?


Brian Brinkley  14:18  

Well, we're actually already ended, integrated into the software.


So that's why we went that route. And it took us a year to go that route. I mean, he didn't give us a certification without running us through the ringer, in alight did the same thing. And so did prism HR. So that's why it's built into their software now. So you can literally turn it on, we're talking through Sap to some big companies. It's very impressive. I mean, we can literally turn it on in days, as opposed to spending months going through an integration cycle. We did this it cost us a lot of time, energy, and money upfront to build out the infrastructure to do that so that we can offer it quickly


James Mackey  14:59  

For sure. So for companies, HR teams, people ops, whatever you want to call it, that want to take the first step towards making this happen, what does that process look like to get this implemented? Step by step?


Brian Brinkley  15:13  

Well, right now, they can either contact us at  QRails, If again, alight is their provider or integrator, they can contact their light sales rep, they can contact their SAP sales rep, their prism PEO sales rep, or just about anybody. So we're selling through these channels, and they can connect us directly. But if they already have somebody who's doing their payroll and benefits through these companies, they can connect them and they will connect to us. 


James Mackey  15:46  

So that's interesting. So a lot of the growth you're experiencing through the partners that you're integrated with, or is it direct sales? I'm kind of just curious about how that works.


Brian Brinkley  15:57  

Yeah, right now, most of it is through our partners, but we'll always do correct sales, right? I mean, small startup companies, we don't turn down money.


James Mackey  16:07  

Right? Who would want to do that? No, that's great, though, because it's also just more cost-effective as you scale to maintain like, really, really solid margins, which obviously helps with fundraising. As far as future growth and scale.


Brian Brinkley  16:20  

You sound like you ought to help us fundraise. It's true that we tell people that we're trying to work with our partners so that they can use their existing infrastructure, right? I mean, if you really look at a light, and their digital wallet, they have their own sales force. They have their own account management team, we provide tier-two support and technology. That's what we are, we try and tell people, we're a fintech company. Really? That's why we are a fintech company.


James Mackey  16:49  

Yeah, for sure. So when your positioning right, like let's say in direct sales or the way that you have your partners sell the solution in terms of a value proposition. Like the business outcomes that you're driving for the client? Right? Obviously, there's the employee side of it, but in terms of business objectives, right, and outcomes? Is it talent acquisition, and retention are the primary value add? Or how do you approach that value proposition? Or maybe it's segmented, right? Like, maybe it's a little different, depending on the industry or whatnot. But curious, your thoughts there?


Brian Brinkley  17:23  

Yeah. And that's exactly what it is talent acquisition. Is amazing to me, when we travel around, we listen to the radio, and talk to professional employment organizations or companies. And they're saying part of their talent acquisition is offering people same-day pay. And I'll go back to this anecdotal one about this trucking company, this national trucking company, and said to us, you know, we have people that want to work and they want to work overtime, and they want to work double shifts, but like I was telling you earlier, they don't want to get paid 14 days or a month from now, they want to get paid today. And it works really turning into his markets that are very, I don't want to call them. It's easy to see vertical markets. So we have health care and Long Term Care is a market, right? Retail grocery is a market. Petrol or gas stations are a market and then quick service rep. 


Heck, a lot of the restaurants and QSR ours are staying will pay you on the same day, they're actually advertising it. So it's turned into a benefit in order to attract people and retain them. Right. It is, you know, during COVID a lot of restaurants, restaurants, right? And delivery, like let's say a pizza delivery place. When's the last time you tip somebody in cash that delivered you food through like, you know, a pizza delivery, or GrubHub? Or whatever it is that delivers food, don't they just leave it on the door and go away? Well, that guy is driving his car again. And they're wanting to tip that person out. Because you're doing it digitally. They want to move that to them. So they'll come back to work tomorrow because they won't come back to work unless they can buy gas, right? 


So there are a lot of people that are using this today. Is though, in order to attract talent, and retain talent. And it's funny, I see articles people send to me all the time, or they take a snapshot of a picture of somebody saying we're now hiring, no matter of fact, I want to say it was United Airlines. I shouldn't say that. But there was a big poster. One of my guys took a picture that says we're hiring people, you know, inside of the airport to push people around on the wheelchair, but we'll pay you today this way. And it's just a big poster. It's like you're seeing it everywhere. All the airlines are advertising.


James Mackey  19:49  

That's really smart because I feel like I don't know if that's the right phrase. I don't know how to say this simply but that concept of capacity utilization right so you have X amount of contractors or employees And you're essentially trying to increase capacity where you're getting the employee or the Contractor Group to put in more hours, right? So it's like if they know that, okay, I can receive payment later today, right? They might be more incentivized too, right? Like, it's an incentive, right? It's like, Hey, let me double down or hey, I feel good today. I feel like I can do some more, you know, I can make more, I could see that being a huge value add.


Brian Brinkley  20:33  

It is. Here's another weird thing with that trucking company. So we're in there. And we're talking to the trucking company general manager, and he says, You know, I wish my people would fill out there. I wish my supervisors would sign off on the timesheets on a daily basis, Brian, this is never going to work. They never sign off on the timesheets. So I never know what my cash flow is or where my operating expenses are going to be week to week. 


We were talking to these guys for 10 minutes and the managers were saying, Wow, my people can get paid today, I'll stay late and sign all the timesheets, and post the timesheets so that they can get paid today. So an hour into this meeting this GM says, I've been trying to get them to do this for three years so that I can manage my cash flow. And he goes, you've been here 30 minutes, and they're all volunteering to stay late and fill out the timesheets for their employees that worked overtime, just so they can get paid today because they would. So it really helps the whole business cycle. But I don't think anybody sees it until they see, you know, it happened in practice. Does that make sense?


James Mackey  21:40  

That makes a tonne of sense. So I guess my next question is like, okay, so if I'm buyer persona CFO, right, like we talked about implementation from like, an HR software, you know, flipping a switch, pretty easy to get integrated. Are there any obstacles or hesitations from CFOs that are like, well, we have this current and current process system built out to do things this way? Are there any kinds of shifts that need to occur from a finance and accounting perspective? I'm just curious if there's anything you've seen consistently on that side of the house.


Brian Brinkley  22:14  

It's funny because they instinctively think so. But what happens is because we're integrated into the payroll processing cycle, is because we check the time and attendance in real-time, input, a payroll deduction inside the payroll software that we already know, that we can get, they just normally run payroll like they're normally running it every two weeks, and it doesn't change anything for them. And we went to a PEO in Kansas. And they said we turn this on. And we've got people sitting here waiting to figure out what's going to go wrong. And they go, we've done 800 integrations. And this is the first one we've ever done, that nobody called and asked us a question. No financial officer and one of our small businesses called and asked this question, we literally are sitting here waiting for the phone to ring for somebody to ask us a question. 


And so on the other side in Europe, because we're global, in Europe, in Spain, and in France, they've made it mandatory that employees get paid on a daily pay if they want. And we ask them, Well, how are you doing it today, and they said, We're doing everything on a spreadsheet, we're writing down what everybody wants today that we're handing them in cash, and then we have to do it. And when they found out that we're just immediately posting something into a payroll deduction, we have to show him we literally show him a demo of it while we're posting the transaction, and they can see it, and they're like, nothing changes. So they think most CFOs or HR Payroll providers think this is going to take months, it's going to be laborious, and James, it took us years to get here. Okay, I don't want people to think we didn't work our butts off to get here. Okay.


James Mackey  24:08  

I gotcha. I gotcha. Well, what about approvals, right? Because it's just like the approval process of going through, like payroll as well, right? Like, that's, I'm assuming, I mean, that there has to be somebody who's available the same day, to go through approvals. And they have to be willing to go through approvals every day.


Brian Brinkley  24:27  

Yeah, that's what I was saying about the trucking company. But sometimes that attendance systems for salaried employees are done automatically.


James Mackey  24:33  

I guess it's like a salaried position. That's really simple. But like, for the gig economy, there has to be somebody available every single day for approvals, which I guess that's like the one part of the process that remains kind of manual, right? That has to be accounted for.


Brian Brinkley  24:52  

It does, but sometimes they're automated, right? So there are a lot of automated Time and Attendance systems that are built into point of sale systems for like a restaurant. So they can see that they're working their shift and they begin their shift. And people now clock in and clock out electronically, whether it's on a mobile application. So look at Uber, they're clocked in and clocked out on Uber, when they're picking up a job for the gig economy, right? So you'll go to a restaurant now and you'll see the point of sale systems like I guess toast, and you can see that the waiter is actually clocking in and out and taking your order and picking up your receipt, and then you're tipping them there. 


So a lot of that information is actually accumulated in real time, digitally through these payroll systems there's time and attendance systems are these point-of-sale systems. So you can integrate into those and you can collect a lot. So tipping in wages is really easy. Because even if I don't pay you, James hourly, for being a waiter, I can see that you made that tip, right? And I can see that if you're a food delivery person you've spent that mileage delivering that food. So some companies are coming back to us and saying, just pay out tips and mileage for us. And then if we get somebody to do, you know, approval of time and attendance at a workshop, then you can do that also. So there are always these components that people can get paid?


James Mackey  26:14  

For sure. So I know we're coming up on time here, but I just wanted to kind of zoom out and get your perspective on the future of employment, the future of your industry, like where you see things heading over the next 5 to 10 years when it comes to employment, financial options for companies, employees. I mean, obviously, this is kind of a vague question, right? You can answer it however you want. But what's your version of the future for employment and these types of solutions?


Brian Brinkley  26:44  

Well, I think, and I don't want to just focus on earning wage access, wage access is a portion of what I'll call financial wellness. And we look at people and say, it's all about the two-week pay cycle or the month pay cycle is dead. People, we're gonna get paid out on a daily basis for one. And then they want access to digital banking, cross border, remittance, you know, credit, scoring, all these things that you can do in what I'll call a NEO bank environment. I mean, James, when's the last time you went to the physical bank that you are banking on? Right?


James Mackey  27:21  

Branches keep closing. 


Brian Brinkley  27:26  

When I was at Google, the funny thing is, I was at Google, and they were talking about Google Wallet. And they said, Well, why would this be any better than a debit card or credit card? And I said, Well, how many people here have a child from the age of 10 to 17? And of course, you know, there's a bunch of hands that go up, and I go, Well, how many of them have a credit card or a debit card? Nearly none. And I said, Well, how many people have a mobile phone? And they're like, everybody's hand goes up because we're at Google, right? 


And then I tell people today, those are the people you can imagine and I got employees that work for me to have like 17-year-old kids out on their first job, and they go there, and the employer says, Okay, you can have the job. And you want to Okay, now you got to go to a bank and you got to open up a bank account, you got to give me a routing number and bring me a canceled check. And I can send you ACH or click the button here. And I'll issue you a bank account, let's that basically was a Neil bank account with a digital card, and then we'll send you a plastic debit card, and you have all the same services that you would if you've opened up a banking account immediately, and you have all the same access to money in real-time, and all your payment history and tracking, we can do that. And we can do that because we are in the end financial service, right? 


Once we onboard an employer, we can actually issue accounts to their employees, because we can already track everything. And we can already certify everything and we can go through compliance with them.


James Mackey  29:00  

So you can essentially operate as a bank, it sounds like because you can basically own these bank accounts. That's probably optional, right? They could have a sense of theirs or use yours. Right? It's just really cool.


Brian Brinkley  29:15  

In the US, what happens is we partner with banks to offer these services. So we're providing banking services on behalf of a bank.


James Mackey  29:22  

Okay, so like on the back end would be like PNC your Bank of America. So you're not actually like owning the bank account process.


Brian Brinkley  29:29  

Right. It's just like, it's funny because the analogy I like to use is if you got like a Southwest Airline card or a card that you got at Home Depot or something, that credit card or debit card, you don't even know what bank it operates on, do you right, yeah, you go so we operate these services for banks that do stuff like that.


James Mackey  29:49  

So it is like a potential future. Just doing the banking side in-house. That sounds really interesting. I don't know if that's something you would consider but um, I'm curious if that's ever come up.


Brian Brinkley  30:01  

Well, let's say we'll do banking services. We don't have any intention of being a bank. We don't want to be a regulated bank. But service.


James Mackey  30:11  

If I had enough money, I'd probably start a bank. But that's fine. I am probably at least 20 years out from that. So we'll see. We'll see how it goes. 


Brian Brinkley  30:21  

These services are going to be part of just like offering insurance for employers, I think offering these services is going to be a requirement.


James Mackey  30:31  

I think so. I think we're moving towards flexibility on demand. Yeah, just wellness, as you put it, I mean, there's just going to be so many options out there. And I think it just it, the higher, you know, just trend of like, just general flexibility within the workforce. Like it's becoming more and more acceptable year after year to not just have this one job and stay there for years. But, even for, you know, senior-level skilled labor types of positions, we're seeing people go the contracting route, the solopreneur route, where they have several contracts working at once. And people like that flexibility, right? They charge more per hour, but then, you know, they go on more vacations, right? Or they have more time with their family. 


I mean, we're just starting to see that become more commonly accepted. And we're also seeing companies feel comfortable outsourcing more stuff that isn't their core competency, right? Like, there used to be this obsession with keeping all of these different functions in-house. And now it's, I feel like, companies are more and more just keeping strategic stuff in-house, right? So like, product, for instance, right? Or sometimes revenue functions, like marketing, make sense. But, you know, for a lot of the other functions within a company companies are starting to say, like, let's just outsource this, like, we don't need to, you know, own these, you know, firm, ongoing costs. We don't need to own, you know, the energy taking the stand these up to optimize this. So we're just seeing a lot more flexibility there in general, too. Right.


Brian Brinkley  31:55  

Exactly. Well, now that we've solved world hunger, we should let everybody go.


James Mackey  32:01  

Yeah. This has been a tonne of fun. Brian, I appreciate you coming to the show. And if you had fun, feel free to come back, we can do round two.


Brian Brinkley  32:12  

Oh, that'd be nice. I'd appreciate that. I'll let you know where we are in a couple of six months after our B round and bringing on some more employers.


James Mackey  32:19  

All right. So I'm looking forward to hearing all about that. And hey, real quick, though, if people want to engage with you online, or your company, what's the best way to get in contact with you?


Brian Brinkley  32:29  

Yeah, they can reach me. I think it's B And then if I don't answer directly, I'll try and get to you as fast as I can. 


James Mackey  32:43  

Love it. Love it. And for everybody else tuning in, thank you for joining us, and we'll see you next time. Take care. 

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